Value of: #9 plus (NYR) for #5 (ARZ)

Discussion in 'Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk' started by lanceuppercut75, Jun 13, 2018.

  1. lanceuppercut75

    lanceuppercut75 Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2016
    Messages:
    1,542
    Likes Received:
    180
    Trophy Points:
    66
    Location:
    Toronto area
    Hypothetically, what if NYR scouts are telling Gorton they are VERY confident that one of these (non Dahlin) defensemen will become a #1 guy, and they know which guy it is?

    First four picks are highly likely all forwards and Dahlin. Arizona is in a position to take any other D in the draft at #5, but their fans are looking at Wahlstrom primarily and worried about Chayka preferring Tkachuk. Both forwards.

    #6 #7 #8 are all rumoured to be targetting defensemen. DET (Bouchard Hughes Boqvist), VAN (Dobson Hughes Bouchard) and CHI (Hughes Dobson Bouchard). Only real forward interest I've read on here is Tkachuk at #7 if Dobson is already gone.

    What does NYR have to pay ARZ in order to move up and guarantee they get the D that their scouts project to be a #1? Keep in mind that Wahlstrom will likely still be available at #9 for Arizona, as well as one other top 10 projected player (best guess is Kotkaniemi or Boqvist).
     
  2. BBKers

    BBKers Registered User

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    8,496
    Likes Received:
    517
    Trophy Points:
    139
    Occupation:
    Hotel Owner
    Location:
    Bialystok, Poland
    Home Page:
    28
     
    pld459666 likes this.
  3. SingnBluesOnBroadway

    SingnBluesOnBroadway Retired

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2002
    Messages:
    33,135
    Likes Received:
    648
    Trophy Points:
    214
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    NYC
    Awards:
    I'm not sure what the ask is here. The entire OP is based on a hypothetical.
     
  4. TGWL

    TGWL Registered User

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2011
    Messages:
    3,507
    Likes Received:
    421
    Trophy Points:
    94
    This thread would have been easier just saying.. "What would Rangers have to offer to swap picks with Arizona" Instead we have "If Arizona can definitely pick who they want at #9, what's the cost?". Does that change with the offer increasing if Arizona likely doesn't get the player they want at #9?
     
  5. NYR713

    NYR713 Registered User

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Messages:
    1,705
    Likes Received:
    59
    Trophy Points:
    71
    With the idea of a choice of the 3 top RD in this draft sitting at 5, going by OP and most consensus that Dahlin and 3 forwards go 1-4, I don't see why ARI would move from the spot without some major payment. Looking at their D, they have OEL and Chychrun on LD and all signed RD are 30+ and I don't see much in the RD pipeline. I can't see why they wouldn't be all over 1 of Bouchard, Dobson or Boqvist.
     
  6. Savant

    Savant Registered User

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2013
    Messages:
    12,968
    Likes Received:
    995
    Trophy Points:
    124
    If the Rangers go to 5 they are taking Wahlstrom

    But yeah this
     
    pld459666 likes this.
  7. Savant

    Savant Registered User

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2013
    Messages:
    12,968
    Likes Received:
    995
    Trophy Points:
    124
    OP wants to move down to 9 to take Wahlstrom.

    Which is ironic because the Rangers want to move up to take Wahlstrom
     
    pld459666, Doriva and Klaus3154 like this.
  8. rt

    rt DingDongTippIsGone! Sponsor

    Joined:
    May 13, 2004
    Messages:
    61,077
    Likes Received:
    3,822
    Trophy Points:
    186
    Location:
    County Cork
    Yep. Pretty much.
     
  9. Riseonfire

    Riseonfire R+L=J

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2009
    Messages:
    7,759
    Likes Received:
    610
    Trophy Points:
    109
    Moving from 9 to 5 in this draft is silly. It will cost you a decent amount, even though the players in that range are largely interchangeable.
     
  10. Klaus3154

    Klaus3154 Registered User

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2018
    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    23
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New York
    Don’t think Rangers should pay the price but let’s say your theory is true about the scouts having their eye on top D man outside of Dahlin...

    Arizona gets Zuccarello, 9oa, 70oa

    Rangers get 5oa, Max Domi, 55oa

    I feel the Rangers can get a better payment of Zucc but interested in the value
     
  11. Jared Dunn

    Jared Dunn Registered User

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2013
    Messages:
    5,816
    Likes Received:
    379
    Trophy Points:
    79
    Location:
    Yellowknife
    Probably 28 or Namestnikov
     
  12. Monument

    Monument Start The Shooting

    Joined:
    May 3, 2006
    Messages:
    12,235
    Likes Received:
    455
    Trophy Points:
    154
    Occupation:
    Professional Crastinator
    Location:
    Long Island
    Home Page:
    I wouldn't give up a first to move 4 spots. Not with this year's class.
     
  13. mouser

    mouser Business of Hockey

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2006
    Messages:
    20,663
    Likes Received:
    1,333
    Trophy Points:
    170
    Location:
    South Mountain
    It's an interesting exercise this year. The players from #4 to #9 seem to be pretty closely ranked in the overall consensus. So on one hand you could argue you should be able to get a player at #9 with similar value to #5.

    On the other hand, all the teams are going to have very different rankings of the prospects and will almost certainly value the player at #5 on their list significantly higher then the one at #9.
     
  14. Klaus3154

    Klaus3154 Registered User

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2018
    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    23
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New York

    I would do Namestnikov in a heartbeat
     
  15. bernmeister

    bernmeister Registered User

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2010
    Messages:
    14,858
    Likes Received:
    269
    Trophy Points:
    124
    Occupation:
    multiple hats
    Location:
    Da Big Apple

    Great OP.

    I think the answer is yes, 'yotes are willing enough to make it available, but it depends on how much competitive bid there is for the pick.

    Zuc might be involved, but assume they are thinking more like
    9 + 28 + Namest
    for
    5OA + 2nd
     
  16. Klaus3154

    Klaus3154 Registered User

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2018
    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    23
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New York
    Are you aware that Arizona doesn’t have their original 2nd? They have a late second that is 55oa
     
  17. cwede

    cwede Registered User

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2010
    Messages:
    2,654
    Likes Received:
    75
    Trophy Points:
    71
    sorry i just don't see the need to go from 9 to 5 and burn an asset,
    there is so much differences of opinion regarding players 3-12 anyway, a player NYR really wants will likely be there at 9
     
  18. storosten

    storosten Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2014
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    16
    26OA + 28OA + Namestnikov FOR 5OA
     
  19. Brock Radunske

    Brock Radunske 안양종합운동장 빙상장

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2012
    Messages:
    13,872
    Likes Received:
    2,113
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Then you won't move up.
    It makes no sense for the other team to drop 4 spots from the top of the draft unless NYR includes #28.
     
  20. NewYorkNick

    NewYorkNick 25's the new 40 Sponsor

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2017
    Messages:
    1,191
    Likes Received:
    1,243
    Trophy Points:
    81
    Location:
    Stamford CT
    Awful proposal for the 5th overall.
     
    domaug and SteadyFreddie like this.
  21. pld459666

    pld459666 Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2002
    Messages:
    19,859
    Likes Received:
    499
    Trophy Points:
    199
    Location:
    Danbury, CT
    With OEL agreeing to a deal, did he get assurances that the team is going to be players for major improvements now, not in 2 years when whoever they get at 5 may help.

    I could see a deal for 5 that gets them now help without requiring a top 10 selection in return.

    I think the Yotes motivation has changed somewhat over the last few weeks (as OEL negotiations progressed)

    Zuccs, Spooner and the TB 1st for 5OA
     
  22. IPreferPi

    IPreferPi A Nonny Mouse

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2012
    Messages:
    11,237
    Likes Received:
    621
    Trophy Points:
    139
    Occupation:
    Analyst
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Chayka all but ruled out trading the 5 OA outright for an NHL player last week:

     
  23. pld459666

    pld459666 Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2002
    Messages:
    19,859
    Likes Received:
    499
    Trophy Points:
    199
    Location:
    Danbury, CT
    Seems like a mistake in my humble opinion.

    At some point, an effort has to be made to bring in more immediate help when you have a defender like OEL in the prime of their career.

    5OA is not going to help for 2 years at the least and more likely not until 3 years.

    That's a lot of wasted hockey for OEL
     
  24. IPreferPi

    IPreferPi A Nonny Mouse

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2012
    Messages:
    11,237
    Likes Received:
    621
    Trophy Points:
    139
    Occupation:
    Analyst
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    We brought in immediate help last year by trading the 7th OA for starting goaltender and a 2C. Our biggest holes on the roster are a true first pairing RD and a 1C, and we aren't going to land either of those without giving up an exorbitant amount of young talent and the 5th OA. I'm sure OEL was well aware of this during negotiations and indicated his willingness to resign anyway to a team-friendly deal.

    There are ways to find immediate help for our young core without giving up a top five pick.
     
  25. pld459666

    pld459666 Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2002
    Messages:
    19,859
    Likes Received:
    499
    Trophy Points:
    199
    Location:
    Danbury, CT
    Fair points.

    Never hurts to have a top 5 selection waiting in the wings as additional help, or a trade chip later in the year/season
     

Share This Page

monitoring_string = "358c248ada348a047a4b9bb27a146148"